EvilZone
General Tech => Hardware => : Fur June 25, 2013, 03:40:29 AM
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I have £800 to build a gaming PC. I'll be using this for gaming, programming, and just about everything else I do.
Here is some stuff I've already decided on:
RAM: Corsair CMZ8GX3M2A1600C9 8GB 1600MHz - £58.29 // Cheap and has good reviews.
Monitor: ASUS VE247H - £129.99 // Pretty good reviews (and price). Will try to find a cheaper one.
HDD: Western Digital 1TB internal Hard Drive - £50.97 // Cheapest I could find.
Wireless card: TP-LINK TL-WDN4800 N900 - £27.98 // Bit overkill, may select a cheaper one.
DVD drive: LG GH24NS95.AUAA 24x SATA - £14.99
CPU:
I'm looking for an Intel i5.
Arbitrary overclocking is a must (unlocked chip).
I'm currently considering the i5-3570K.
Graphics card:
I want to be able to run most 2012 games on high (maybe that's pushing it?).
Motherboard:
32GB of RAM support.
At least 4 SATA ports.
PSU:
I'll sort that out after I've got everything else chosen.
Case:
I was thinking about the Corsair Carbide Series 300R CC-9011014-WW or the Zalman Z11.
Lots of cooling support would be nice.
Fans:
I'll decide on case fans once I have decided on a case.
I'll decide on a CPU fan when I have decided on a motherboard.
This will be my main machine for 3 - 5 years (I'll upgrade it from time to time).
I don't really want to spend the full £800, but will if it is necessary.
I've never built a computer before, although I have watched some videos of people assembling them (seems straightforward enough).
What else will I need (even small things like cables) aside from an ESD wristwrap?
So, what do you recommend?
P.S: Sorry if I sound like an idiot, hardware has never really been my thing (> TFW poor).
P.S.S: If my expectations are unrealistic, I can just sacrifice graphics card performance.
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fur, do you have a mic and a voice chat program? when helping someone build i prefer to just be able to talk...as this shit gets super detailed.
anyway some basics:
a wrist strap is unnecessary so long as you ground yourself to the case(ie always have an arm touching it.) not saying you cant use a wrist strap or some such, just that if you are careful it is an unnecessary purchase. i built my first machine something like 16 years ago, and built/been inside who knows how many hundreds since. never fried a component.
When building a PC always start with your mother board. this informs the parts your going to purchase. if you do it the other way around you end up excluding parts that could be used.
when looking at a PSU ALWAYS spend the extra cash for at least a 2 rail, preferably 4. Make sure to figure out what wattage your system is going to total under load, and get a PSU that is at least 50w over that. preferably 100-150w over. This is to prevent it from working its ass off during peak load of your components. it will last longer, and you shouldnt get crashes from lack of power. the 4 rail(or 2 rail) simply helps ensure that your components dont get damaged. I recommend replacing the PSU EVERY new build(3-5 years). When one of these things starts going bad it can fry your components. trust me its no fun spending 800$ on a system, skimping on the PSU and watching it fry your system.
ignore this if your going water cooled:
Buying a super high end case generally isnt worth the investment, you can generally find a very good case for between 50-80$. Just make sure to purchase extra fans for the system. high temps shorten the life of your hardware.
With that being said, id say of the two you are currently looking at the corsair case is better. zalman z11 only has 2 120mm and 2 80mm fan locations. If you intend to reuse the case, or upgrade the systems potential, you will hit a limit of how much the case can cool your parts very fast. When adding extra fans remember you want some of them pulling in and some pushing air out, generally you would do 2 pushing out the back/top. side pulling in, front pulling in. Also keep in mind its better to have your case on top of your desk and clear of obstructions to maximize airflow/prevent it from sucking in heated air from the back.
eh this scratches the surface.....hope it helps :)
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Well, I'm not at all hardware inclined and I've never built my own PC before so the next bit of advice I'm going to give should be taken as such.
Why not go for an i7? Also, I'm not sure if this applies to just laptops or if it's all screens but maybe find something other than an Asus monitor. It seems to me that everyone happens to buy Asus monitors for their rig so maybe I'm wrong and there just fine but, I've heard a lot of bad things about Asus hardware. Particularly the screens. Also, I've had an Asus laptop for about two years and the hardware is kind of crapping out on me. The screen has dead pixels. I love my laptop but I'm not sure I'd get Asus products again. Someone correct me if I'm wrong about this.
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This may sound old fashioned but saving money on your CPU is not the way the go.
You can upgrade almost anything but that.
I have a i7-3770k running stock 3.5GHz.
Overclocked the 'turbo' to 4.4 running stable.
Ive considered those cheap watercoolers but after reading a lot of reviews I decided to go with air cooling.
The noctua D14 is really good and keeps my system on idle at roughly 30 degrees C.
On high load it never comes much above 60, which is very acceptable for i7 cores.
I suggest you go for an SSD drive as main (small is fine) and some slower drive for storage.
When you have that the rest is up to you :P
You could expand this to a decent gaming rig with a good GPU.
RAM is not that important , you can always stick in another module.
DVD drive lol .. what is that :P
I believe I have exactly one in some laptop somewhere, thats so 2005.
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If you're thinking of using your GPU to process data, go with AMD. They can process more by a cheaper price than NVIDIA.
DVD drive lol .. what is that :P
Lol. I'm currently thinking of switching my HDD with an SSD and switch my DVD drive with the original HDD, since I rarely use the DVD drive and having a bigger storage capacity would be more advantageous for me. Oh, I'm talking about a laptop, as this would be just stupid on a desktop.
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If you're thinking of using your GPU to process data, go with AMD. They can process more by a cheaper price than NVIDIA
Very true, for gaming id also say Nvidia but if you want to crack hashes anytime go with ATI, I had a Triple GTX690 setup and the gaming was amazing... the Hash cracking was pathetic though with a single HD6990 outperforming all 3 Nvidia cards.
Also, Get a SSD and a normal drive, then run the Operating systems of SSD but use the larger drives for storage.
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@lucid/proxx/fur :CPU is not all its cracked up to be. while its good to have a strong cpu, going with an i7 would leave him with a crap computer for what he wants to do. The only real difference between an i7 vs i5 quad core is an extra 2mb l3 cache. is that worth 100$+? no. especially when looking at the fact he wants to game, very few games are nearly as CPU intensive as GPU intensive. As for cracking, obviously he can still use GPU power in addition to the CPU. going with a quad core i5 is a better choice. if he were actually advanced he could do his research on an i3 save even more and pick up an i7 for a steal. but that would take a long time to get into...so just going to recommend i5 for what he wants to do. (well really id recommend amd over intel, more bang for the buck, but meh)
anyway aside from that ram is VERY important. its not just "stick another stick in" channel speeds, cas latency and compatibility matter. This is why its better to pick up a duel or quad channel kit vs buying them as singles. they actually test that the ram works well together. As far as the cas latency goes for what he is looking at its rather decent, especially while over clocked. assuming the motherboard he gets has good overclocking support/unlock potential the ram will suit his needs well.
To me, if your gaming in the past hell decade, ATI has been ahead of nvidia. That being said always be careful of your final manufacturer.(for either nvidia or ati) Different manufactures use different quality parts and quality of tests on their cards. Which is why you will see things like one card(of the same chipset) having a faster memory/clock speed than another.
few last general things:
1:Acer has gone WAY down hill these past 5 years as far as quality goes. i would NOT recommend anything that they make.
2:if you notice a component missing stats.(using GPU as an example) such as its clock speed or memory speed etc, its 99% of the time because the company's specs cant compete, ie they used really shitty part their. do not buy that card.
3:SSD's are great for booting/playing games off of. downside is security wise they suck at erasure from a security standpoint.
4:Do not look to buy a "next" gen mobo. the latest PCI standard is out soon, meaning it will NOT be good for upgrading. find a solid i5 board to do you for the next 2-4 years then upgrade everything.
well i was more awake for this one...but its still just the surface :P. hope it helps.
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a wrist strap is unnecessary so long as you ground yourself to the case
Better safe than sorry :P Also, a wrist strap is always nice (especially for a couple of quid).
Acer has gone WAY down hill these past 5 years as far as quality goes. i would NOT recommend anything that they make.
Noted. I'll look for an alternative for about the same price.
always be careful of your final manufacturer.(for either nvidia or ati) Different manufactures use different quality parts and quality of tests on their cards.
This is what confused me when I was looking at the Nvidia GeForce GTX 660. There were so many manufacturers making the same thing. Thanks for that.
I suggest you go for an SSD drive as main (small is fine) and some slower drive for storage.
I was thinking of that, but then reconsidered as they're expensive (relative to platter-based drives in terms of storage capacity to price) and are hard to erase from. I'll probably get one later down the line (hopefully by then they'll be cheaper ;)).
fur, do you have a mic and a voice chat program?
Unfortunately not.
I think I love all of you.
I've considered all of your advice and am now looking for parts.
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I hope you don't need monitor
all 813$ or 882$ with 7950
Staff note: all bbcode shit removed along with the text. Post properly or don't post at all.
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all 813$ or 882$ with 7950
I use British Pound Sterling, so $813 converts to £537.
That's bloody excellent for the price, but doesn't really suit my needs. Thanks anyway. Haz a cookie for your effort.
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I use British Pound Sterling, so $813 converts to £537.
That's bloody excellent for the price, but doesn't really suit my needs. Thanks anyway. Haz a cookie for your effort.
you never did answer/address a few things, are you still dead set on an intel chipset or say a nvidia card?
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you never did answer/address a few things, are you still dead set on an intel chipset or say a nvidia card?
I'm going to go with an Intel chipset, but I'm not sure on the GPU.
Here is my current specifications:
CPU: Intel Core i5 4670K
GPU: ??? // Maybe a Nvidia GTX 660 TI or a 670.
PSU: ??? // 600 - 750 watts should be enough.
Motherboard: Gigabyte Z87X-OC
Case: Fractal Design Define R4
RAM: Corsair CMZ8GX3M2A1600C9 Vengeance 8GB
HDD: Western Digital 1TB internal Hard Drive
I'm just a little worried about which motherboard to get.
I'll post when I've purchased the parts.
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I'm going to go with an Intel chipset, but I'm not sure on the GPU.
Here is my current specifications:
CPU: Intel Core i5 4670K
GPU: ??? // Maybe a Nvidia GTX 660 TI or a 670.
PSU: ??? // 600 - 750 watts should be enough.
Motherboard: Gigabyte Z87X-OC
Case: Fractal Design Define R4
RAM: Corsair CMZ8GX3M2A1600C9 Vengeance 8GB
HDD: Western Digital 1TB internal Hard Drive
I'm just a little worried about which motherboard to get.
I'll post when I've purchased the parts.
by current specs you mean you already own these? if so upgrading to an i7 from taht i5 would be a waste of a lot of money. or if its the one you are looking at, i would say its not a bad pick at all for the 200$ range.
That mobo is both a good over all brand, as well as having some neat features. however a few points to consider:
if your looking at some of the larger(length wise) CPU heatsinks you need to be carefull that it doesnt block out ram slots and clears the built in sink around the CPU. Most heatsinks wont be an issue, but a few you wont be able to use and if you plan on over clocking at all you HAVE to get a good after market heatsink. That aside id say it looks like a solid board, THAT being said 400$ for a motherboard? holy fuck. As stated earlier new gen mobos are just around the corner. meaning that 400$ mobo is a one off. so a few suggestions:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157293 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157293)
pos/cons:
heatsink can not be super wide with this design. if the cards are large you may not get full use of slots. still good capacitors and features especially for the price. Ive never used this brand board nor do i know anyone who has. still rather decent reviews, so i would say from what i see the best bang for buck by a long shot.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130642 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130642)
pros/cons:
about double the price of the other board i listed(and about half the price of the one you are looking at. 3x pci x16 slots, its major downfall is only 2 usb 3.0 ports. other upsides include WELL known manufacture, good over clocking features, quality parts/components. really to me a tough choice, that would come down to how soon you plan on upgrading your system. if you plan on at least 2-4 years i would probably go with this board. otherwise the other one is the way to go.
PSUs: well since you seem to be relatively lost here i will toss out a few to give you an idea of what im looking at and why.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817374051 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817374051)
pro/cons:
Not a lot of reviews kicking around about this one yet, and its at the lower range (700w) power wise. but it has some AWESOME stats. destroys anything in its class and most stuff out of its class power consumption wise. High quality parts and looks nice too. Also passed a huge number of tests/has some great features. Obviously its a 4 rail.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817152043 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817152043)
pros/cons:
a good PSU, 850w with a decent brand name behind it. i honestly dont think this stacks up to the one i posted before despite the extra wattage available. posted more for you to compare to the first and last one i will post so you can see WHY it doesnt measure up.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817371053 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817371053)
pros/cons:
most expensive of the 3, and seems to have some DoA issues. Also sounds like the 20+4 pin isnt set up well. Aside from that the stats/parts going in are very nice, and its 850w, which should guarantee its never going to be stressed on your system. However between the price, the DoA issues, the cord issue, and the fact that it only has one extra "good" feature over the first one means that i dont think this is the best buy.
Some more general thoughts on this area: generally going over 4 rails increases price dramatically, and just isnt worth it. at the same time going 4 rails used to be SUPER expensive(and still worth it!) but now its at the point that even 4 rail PSU's compete decently with even single rail PSU's costs. So to me 4 rails is now a no brainer. its well worth the extra 15-40$ you will spend. On top of it you tend to get better parts/testing in a 4 rail PSU than a single or duel rail. Add in the energy savings from the first choice and it will over time pay for itself over anything else i can find.
GPU:
So basics, atm your paying a extraordinary amount extra for 670 vs a 660. by that i mean you can match all of its stats but its memory interface(192 vs 256) this over all is not worth what amounts to close to a 1/3rd price increase in the card.
near as i can tell this is the best price for the pound 660 card on the market:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121656 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121656)
ATI:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127722 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127722)
this is actually the closest ive seen the two competitors in a while. i would say that your real choice should come down to what games you plan on playing the most and what card they work with the best for a final decision. but the points on this card:
Its a little cheaper. the stats basically stack up against each other quite nicely the only real difference being the memory clock speed(slower on ATI 4800 vs 6008) and the memory interface(higher on ATI 256 vs 192) I would also say the manufacture/parts for the ATI card listed are better. but its really going to come down to in personal preference or what games you plan on playing the most. I would personally go with the ATI, but the nvidia is still a very solid option.
well hope that helps fur :)
Edit:holy balls i had like 80 enter lines below this. oops
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by current specs you mean you already own these?
No, I really should have said something along the line of "shopping list".
This is going to take longer than I anticipated.
And yes, it did help. You're a star. Haz a cookie.
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No, I really should have said something along the line of "shopping list".
This is going to take longer than I anticipated.
And yes, it did help. You're a star. Haz a cookie.
im gonna be busy for a few days so i dont really have time to spend the hours necessary to really look at your other stuff/suggest more items. however if you could give me an idea if you are looking to go with any of those it would help and i will get back to you when i can.
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im gonna be busy for a few days so i dont really have time to spend the hours necessary to really look at your other stuff/suggest more items.
Not a problem, I think I'll manage with all of the text you've posted.
And I just wanted to say this: You've been so incredibly helpful. I don't know put how much I appreciate what you've done into words. I didn't think anyone would ever spend so much time and effort helping a person they've hardly ever talked to. Haz another +1.
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Well im giving my feet a break, so i have time to at least throw out a few other things that were on my mind. i wont be able to research for optimal for you so you atm though.
CPU heatsink/fan. i havent mentioned this yet(i think) and i know it wasnt on your parts list. if you plan on doing any sort of over clocking its a MUST to get a good quality after market heat sink. generally if you know you are getting a after market one you can make sure the you buy just the processor(instead of a bundled heat sink/processor) taht will save you 10-15$ on the CPU purchase price, which obviously will be going straight into a nice new one. The great thing about a really nice after market heat sink(with fan or not) is that you can use it again and again and again so long as it has a bracket that fits for the processor in question. (ie a heat sink that fits an i5 will fit an i7(same socket type) but may not fit the next pentium processor. the only part you can/may need to replace or work on is the fan itself if your case has a side exhaust port for a 120mm fan you may not get a great deal of benefit from a heat sink with a fan, though it will still help some. the general price range you should be look at would be around 50$ for one of these. you can and will find ones both more expensive and less. sometimes you can get an INSANE deal on one for like 20-25$ that is just killer, but most of the time you will be looking more in the 40-70$ range for a really good heat sink. ALWAYS use artic thermal paste products. ALWAYS even on a stock heat sink/processor it will lower your temps by a few degrees. ALWAYS clean the processor of old compound with a non abrasive, static free, non shedding material(glasses cleaning rag or coffee filter work GREAT for this) NEVER touch the bare processor with your hand or the bottom of the heat sink either. (sides dont matter) this is because your oily ass unclean hands will gum up the pores and give you a worse mating surface. If you are buying a processor new you will NOT have to worry about residue/cleaning it. MOST after market heat sinks also do not have any thermal compound on them, so you only have to worry about applying the paste correctly(RTFM that comes with the paste! :P)
dont forget waht i talked about earlier either. make sure you get a case that has at LEAST 3 120mm case fan positions and 2 80mm(5 120 is better, 6 120 even better...) its best to have more airflow IN than out. this both keeps your temps cooler as well as reduces dust buildup.
well when i get the time i will do some more for yah...also decided to make a tut on this so i can just start pointing people to a thread :P Who knows when i will get to that though. got like 15 different topics lined up to write about, tons of crap to read and some gallons of beer to consume. i will probably prioritize this article though.. just not sure when i will get to it/finish it because as you can tell just from my more general over view their is a TON of information to put down. Would someone mind figuring out how to add more hours to the day? thanks.
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We're going to order some stuff in a few days. Here is my current shopping list:
CPU: Intel Core i5-4670K (£161.00 + £4.59; Amazon: KLEN)
// Cooler: ? // Get this later.
Motherboard: Asus Z87-Pro (£155.98; Dabs)
// GPU: ? // Get this later.
RAM: Corsair 8GB Vengeance (£57.85; Amazon)
PSU: Corsair TX650 V2 650W (£69.99; Dabs)
HDD: Western Digital 1TB internal Hard Drive - Caviar Blue (£50.01; Amazon)
Case: Corsair Carbide Series 400R (£81.99; Dabs)
Monitor: Acer G246HLBBID 24" (£109.99; Amazon)
DVD Drive: LG GH24NS95.AUAA 24x (£14.99; Amazon)
Oh and Darkvision, most companies don't take take exchange rates into account when pricing in the UK. Think of a £250 component as a $230 component. There's an article about it here (http://www.pcpro.co.uk/blogs/2009/11/23/the-new-ati-radeon-hd-5970-42-more-expensive-in-the-uk/).
Edit (07/08/2013):
Just ordered the stuff.